Coding Sucks

[Deeeds]

It is important to always remember that coding sucks. In all its forms. Always.

If you can find something else to do with your life, or other ways to express yourself, choose them.

Only as a dire and last resort, go to coding.

Swift is a deceptively complex and deep language. It's got a simple looking syntax and seems succinct... but if you think it is simple and succinct you're making misconceptions and missing its true nature.

Swift is a hugely capable language, and huge. It's not nearly as elegant as it might first seem.

[Aidan_Fire]

@deeeds That depends on the type of person you are. I like coding, even though I have done very little of it because I use hyperPad. (HyperPad doesn’t count as coding right? Since you’re not actually writing code, you’re behaviour nodes around etc)

[Kamdroid]

My opinion
I personally find a lot of programming languages fun and easy to use, like C# and JavaScript.
Nowadays coding has become easier to learn with massive amounts of high quality tutorials and already made frameworks/tools like .NET, NodeJS, PhaserJS, Bootstrap etc

For languages that could be harder to learn, there are alternatives like Xamarin and ElectronJS etc.

TL;DR: Some programming languages may be hard, but as time goes on there will be alternatives and more resources to make it easier.

[Deeeds]

@aidan-oxley hyperPad is definitely coding.

Whilst it's visual, visual coding is still coding... it's still coded commands, just less (or more) opaque than the verbiage from more directly expressed coding "languages".

Coding is (let's make up a definition) the articulation of commands for the digital creation, retrieval and modification of data and its containers, representations and responses to events, inputs and calculations.

Or something like that.

[Deeeds]

@GameCRAZY I've just had a look at that tutorial site you linked in the other thread: https://www.tutorialspoint.com/swift/swift_access_control.htm

It isn't written with any care for English, or the underlying technologies, methodologies and paradigms of Swift. It's lazy, at best.

Swift is probably best learnt from the official books from Apple, which are very well written, and were initially overseen by the creator of the language. And I can assure you, he cares. Well, he did. Apple letting him go was one of the stupidest things of the Tim Cook era, so far.

But back on point: the layout and path, through Apple's Swift Book, is well thought out, and progressively reveals the nuances, power, precision and purposefulness of Swift's design and features. It is one of the best books ever written to introduce a programming language. I strongly suggest starting over, with this book: https://developer.apple.com/library/content/documentation/Swift/Conceptual/Swift_Programming_Language/TheBasics.html

I know... it will be boring to retread some of the ground you've already covered, but it will help lay the foundation you'll need to deal with optionals, initialisers, protocols, function types, generics, associated types and accessors. Swift is a big, bold, capable language, and integral to understanding it is getting to the complex stuff, wherein it begins to connect to the Apple APIs, SDKs and Frameworks, become useful and begin to make sense.

Swift is purposefully designed to work well within the massive pre-existing frameworks of iOS and macOS, and to become a systems language (can write an OS in it) and be learnable as a first programming language. I'm not convinced it got the learnability part right because much of the myriad of initialisation, incredibly strict typing and absurdity of optionals only makes sense when you understand why/how it works within the enormity of Apple's existing frameworks and plays well with Objective-C, C and C++.

[GameCRAZY]

@deeeds I actually started with the Apple tutorial. I also watched about an hour of this incredible video:

They all compliment each other really well, there is this one too:

Thanks for the insight by the way!

[GameCRAZY]

@deeeds said in Coding Sucks:

It is important to always remember that coding sucks. In all its forms. Always.

If you can find something else to do with your life, or other ways to express yourself, choose them.

Only as a dire and last resort, go to coding.

Swift is a deceptively complex and deep language. It's got a simple looking syntax and seems succinct... but if you think it is simple and succinct you're making misconceptions and missing its true nature.

Swift is a hugely capable language, and huge. It's not nearly as elegant as it might first seem.

Speaking of which, I do not think that coding sucks at all.
I enjoy challenging myself, and I enjoy thinking more logically and coherently.

Coding is awesome.

[iTap Development]

@deeeds just saying, a coding forum isnt the best place to be taken seriously when advising against coding, since you’re here too....and not all there.
Personally, I’d rather have blue light on my face than an L on my forehead....if you know what I mean😆

[Deeeds]

Things that suck less than coding:

Riding
Driving
Throwing
Catching
Writing
Painting
Drawing
Thinking
Reading
Watching
Listening
Drinking
Eating
Swimming
Running
Acting
Dancing
Mating
Rearing
Celebrating
Laughing
Mingling
Talking
Walking
Jesting
Joking
Mocking
Chewing
Kicking
Punching

[iTap Development]

@deeeds suck less meaning they still suck?

[iTap Development]

@deeeds said in Coding Sucks:

Things that suck less than coding:

Riding
Driving
Throwing
Catching
Writing
Painting
Drawing
Thinking
Reading
Watching
Listening
Drinking
Eating
Swimming
Running
Acting
Dancing
Mating
Rearing
Celebrating
Laughing
Mingling
Talking
Walking
Jesting
Joking
Mocking
Chewing
Kicking
Punching

So seeing as you do coding, you must not do any of the above? “Only as a dire and last resort, go to coding.”

[Deeeds]

@itap-development

Things that suck less than coding (continued):

Contextualising | verb
Placing or studying in context

[Aidan_Fire]

@deeeds @iTap-Development has a bit of a point, if you think coding sucks so much, why are you doing it? 😳 EDIT: I read your list. DANCING?! Aaaargh I’d rather drown myself.

[Deeeds]

@aidan-oxley I see you're missing the context(s), too.

[Deeeds]

@Aidan-Oxley I'm surprised you think @iTap-Development has a point.

I thought you were more mentally capable. Try to stay in at least some of the contexts of this original post and the subsequent and preceding content and contexts.

In order to know the listed activities are some of the things that suck less than coding, I'd have to have done them.

And coding.

I have.

It's not necessary that one other condition be true, but just in case you're that naive about how advice is given:

Either:
a) I can't find something else to do with my life
OR
b) am unable to find another way to express myself

Say, for example, I dearly want to prototype and show a game concept that's difficult to express to other coders and/or requires a lot of adjustment and refinement to find its sweet spots. That would make the second condition true and justify the use of hyperPad (and coding) whilst not making the first condition true.

No straw man to swing at, no hypocrisy to claim.

Hold that thought, since it's one you've known before, but seem to have forgotten, as has @iTap-Development.

I get that you are keen to see me painted as hypocritical and/or invalidated in what I'm saying. I get that you think any one invalidation of any one thing might make it easier for you to ignore, disparage or forget anything else I've said that's caused you issues.

But to do so you're supporting the removal of all context you already know, and denying the most basic of logic and rationale for saying anything negative about coding.

Some of which is that I'm giving life advice from the point of view of experience and understanding.

So you're setting yourself up to fail at hating on what you're hearing. That will make it true of you.

In order to give this advice, with any confidence, I'd have to be older and more experienced than you, and you be young, inexperienced in other forms of coding and, possibly, inexperienced in the joys of some of the activities I've listed as sucking less than coding, whilst hyperPad usage not be a fully fledged example of, or pathway to, a career in coding.

I am, you are, hyperPad is not.

I know this to be true of both of you, and @GameCRAZY, for whom this thread is intended. This you both know, and is discernible by where this came from and the next piece of content and context: the Swift commentary. If you don't know hyperPad is not a careerist coder's path or tool, I hope you do now.

If you still think @iTap-Development has a point, I'm quite sure you're going to struggle with the understanding and retention of contexts needed to make sense of Swift initialisation.

[Jack8680]

@deeeds, I find coding fun when I'm making something that I want to make, without time constraints or monetary investment.

Writing
Painting
Drawing

I prefer coding over these, and I see them as similar things; having an idea in mind and bringing it to life.

I play games a lot, and so I want to make games that others would enjoy. I might not succeed or even finish a game, but I still enjoy doing it as a hobby at the moment.

If/when I'm doing it as a job I might not like it as much; I don't know since I haven't done it.

[iTap Development]

@aidan-oxley said in Coding Sucks:

@deeeds @iTap-Development has a bit of a point, if you think coding sucks so much, why are you doing it? 😳 EDIT: I read your list. DANCING?! Aaaargh I’d rather drown myself.

Same! 😂

[iTap Development]

@Deeeds is this this you dancing?

[GameCRAZY]

@deeeds I do not know what to say. Just, What?

[iTap Development]

@deeeds since dancing has been mentioned;
Advising other coders not to code(while coding yourself) because you think it sucks, is equivalent to showing up for your dance class and dancing and telling everyone it sucks and that they should avoid it if possible.